Oral History with Kelly Harrison - September 2019

Rachel Muir:

Good afternoon. My name is Rachel Muir. It is the 5th of September and we are here in Asheville, North Carolina. Today, my interview is with Kelly Harrison. Kelly, would you be kind enough to tell us your full name when and where you were born?

Kelly Harrison:

[Kelly Steven Harrison 00:00:19], born at Mission Hospital in Asheville, North Carolina, but grew up my whole life for 18 years in Hot Springs, North Carolina in Madison County, right along the Appalachian trail.

Rachel Muir:

Thank you, Kelly. I will note that this is our second interview. We covered a lot of territory in the first. We've discussed a couple of areas to focus on in regard with the many questions we have to choose from that are part of our interview process and two of them that have come through the front. One is we are going to try and discuss if there were elders or other influences, either you knew personally or in society at large that had some impact on your life.

Kelly Harrison:

Sure. Let's see. As far as influences, probably more so at UNC Asheville because that's whenever I came out at 18. I was out of Hot Springs and Madison County. I was in college, so it was time to kind of do something for myself and take care of myself, as my anxiety was quite high, knowing who I was and what I wanted to be. So at UNC Asheville, they did have a support group, gay and lesbian support group that I went to. And there were some peers there that just kind of got to know well. I can't say they were were best friends or anything like that, but they were certainly people that I became good friends with and were able to talk to. As I'd gotten older, I would say one gentlemen named Bill was very 00:02:00influential. He was a really good friend of my partner and then of course became ... we became good friends and he was from the older generation in regards to, he was a school teacher and he did have a partner, but they lived separately. They were together for 40 years.

Kelly Harrison:

And he had passed away me about three or four years ago and around he's died around 70, 72. But he was just very easygoing, very nice gentleman, very welcoming, very caring type of person. But like I say, he grew up, was born in what, 1940. So being a school teacher and around here, he was very much more concerned about being careful about being out and those type of things. So him 00:03:00being what, 30, 40 years older than I am, I just very supportive, but I just sometimes would have difference of opinions with him in terms of who you were and how you came out and those type of things. So, but as far as just being supportive and encouraging, very loving person, he was that person and always very welcoming. And I think too kind of growing up, I was a big tennis fan, so I would always, you know, Martina Navratilova or Billy Jean King, I was aware of the media, those folks, Elton John and George Michael, the celebrities. Ellen Degeneres and those types of folks. So they also made an impact as well as just everyday people.

Rachel Muir:

Were there books or films or other kind of social sources that you found of 00:04:00interest or helpful?

Kelly Harrison:

So I remember whenever I saw Longtime Companion and that was AIDS, I think that's what it was called. And it was a film about AIDS. Of course, this would've been early 1990s maybe '92, '93 and I remember seeing that movie. It was encouraging but yet scary, informative at the time because it would ... I think that was 1990, 92 was the height of the AIDS crisis. And so, here was a couple that were together or there was the health issues and those types of things. So again, I kind of grew up in a time, my college years were '92 to '93 so you're a little fearful. Here you were gay but yet you also had to deal with this disease and worry about it. That was very prominently in the media.

Kelly Harrison:

So yeah. As far as books, I don't think so. I don't think there were any 00:05:00particular that I can recall. And TV shows, I will say kind of growing up, you would watch shows like Dynasty that would have, I forgot what his name was, but one of the sons that was on there that had came out, but it portrayed him as sort of like, yes, he's gay. But it was almost kind of like he was tormented about it. And they would show him in a relationship with somebody, but typically it was kind of just very gingerly done and there would never be a kiss. It would be a hug and something like that. So, yeah.

Rachel Muir:

Did you read our Tales of the City? You recall that?

Kelly Harrison:

Yeah, I did read that. But I can't honestly say that I can remember very much 00:06:00from it.

Rachel Muir:

I mentioned it because that was about life in San Francisco, which is not like life in Asheville.

Kelly Harrison:

No. No.

Rachel Muir:

So did you find that a lot of the, I suppose the discussion or the cultural norms and gay society had that urban, big city focus on it?

Kelly Harrison:

Oh, yeah. Yeah. That and I mean my partner and I would go to Key West back in the late 1990s. But I think sometimes whenever we grow up we have these fantasies and ideals in our head and then when you actually go there, I think some people are kind of like, "Yeah, this is what I like and I want to move here." Or you have some folks kind of like myself where there it is and it is what it is. But do I want to live here? No. Atlanta would be the same way in the 00:07:001990s, going to Atlanta. I know it was more the ... I guess Midtown section would have the gay bars or the gay restaurants or predominantly gay restaurants. Like Cowtippers and those types of things or sections. And I thought that would be interesting and it was. But as I've kind of grown older and now it's 2019 and I was at Atlanta a couple of months ago and I've kind of found while they're still there, they don't attract me as much as what they did whenever I was younger. Yeah.

Rachel Muir:

What do you think the rural culture is as opposed to small town culture or for gays as opposed to the urban culture, which is part of the usual portrayal of gay lives?

Kelly Harrison:

Let's see here. I don't know. I mean it's ... I'm trying to think if ... I mean 00:08:00I know people, I don't want to put any stereotypes, but I mean ... I don't know. I don't want to say. I don't know if they're happier or sadder or as far as if they have more support or less support. I know I wouldn't want to. I wouldn't want to live ... I mean, growing up in Hot Springs where there's 500 people. One would definitely consider that rural. And that would be a little bit too enclosed for me. I would need to be in a bigger environment with a wide variety of people. I'm not saying anything bad about Hot Springs, but I did grow up there and certainly if there's 500 people then there's fewer people and possibly less diversity.

Rachel Muir:

You mentioned something before we began the interview about maybe as a good thing and that there's more mingling and society as a whole among gay and 00:09:00lesbians and the culture as a whole. You mentioned that there might be a sense of losing a degree of identity. Would you like to talk a little bit about that?

Kelly Harrison:

Yeah. So I think, yeah. Of course I was born in '72 so my coming out and knowing of gay culture would have been the '80s and the '90s. And I think that there was definitely ... going to the gay bar was sort of something a gay person would do. And it was almost kind of like that's our place, that's out thing that we do and we go there. And it was almost kind of like a secretive thing, which can be good and can be bad, probably more so bad. But the good thing is you kind of feel like this is my thing, this is my thing that I get to explore, this is different and that type of thing. And certainly for example, Atlanta in terms of your gay 00:10:00community or your gay area, which I guess might be more so in San Francisco or New York or the bigger cities.

Kelly Harrison:

But as we're now in 2019 it's definitely not uncommon for people who are straight or bisexual to go to the gay clubs or to move into the neighborhood or really just it's almost like it's not ... and I think for gay people it's kind of like just be friends with a wide variety of people. Plus heterosexual people are much more encouraging and engaging and wanting to be our friends as well. So I think that's an awesome, great thing that we're definitely intermingling, being together, and being inclusive with each other and less of the marginalized population. So, but yeah, I mean I think you kind of lose that specific thing 00:11:00that was with the gay culture. But it could be also just me and that I've grown older and I'm around a wide variety of people and I like to be around people. I don't necessarily, I don't choose, well that person is gay, so therefore I'm going to be friends with them. I'm friends with the person because they have similar interests, not because of their orientation. Yeah.

Rachel Muir:

What about do you have any thoughts about the relationship within the LGBTQ community? Do you feel over time there's been stronger interaction or how has that changed or?

Kelly Harrison:

What I have, just perceptions. I think whenever we had AIDS in the '80s and the '90s, and I guess today. I've heard that the lesbian community might've been a little bit more involved with people who were gay and had AIDS or were sick and 00:12:00dying and those types of things. I don't know if maybe that has changed things because people with AIDS and HIV are certainly living longer and being healthier. As far as ... Well, I guess we're probably ... Has it changed? I don't know. I don't know if it has or not. I can't. I guess I can only speak for myself in terms of I don't distinguish. So maybe for me, yes.

Kelly Harrison:

Whenever I was in college coming out, I probably did, was around more people that were gay and lesbian and that type of thing. And as I've gotten older and raised a son, I just kind of was around people. Plus I think too, once you do become friends with people who are gay or lesbian with the assumption that 00:13:00you're going to get along or that you're going to be really good friends. And then you don't because maybe there's that assumption that you're supposed to and then you're not as much as what you think, yet you are friends with this person over here who's heterosexual. I think for myself, I probably have put less emphasis on it as I've gotten older and mature that just be friends with people who are similar to you.

Rachel Muir:

What about the other letters? Bisexual, transgender, queer? Do you know people who are that would identify themselves in that way and has that changed over time?

Kelly Harrison:

I think it's probably changed. Yeah. Because I think you have more folks that are bisexual or transgender that are willing to be more open and go the path that they want to go. I know I had a conversation with a friend of mine yesterday about a person that was transgender and in a real ... The fella who 00:14:00transitioned from male to female is this professional power lifter bodybuilder, I think his last name is Kroc K-R-O-C. And I want to say his first name is Matt Kroc. Just this massive fella, 220 pounds, 5'10 Marine, all that kind of stuff. And my friend was kind of disparaging, he was heterosexual male, towards this person. And I said, "Well, yes, it may seem unusual, but they need to do what they need to do for them. And maybe that person is suicidal, maybe that person is depressed or very anxious. And they needed to do this in order to be better. Should we fault them for that?"

Kelly Harrison:

So I think, I was able to have a with this friend about that. And so I think you just have more people, but because of mainstream make media and it's just more understanding that those that are bisexual or transgender can explore their ... 00:15:00who they are a little bit more and be open about it. I do know some that are bisexual and still married and still kind of in that relationship. But what I do find is that when I talk to them, they will say, "My spouse, my wife knows it." And it just kind of goes there. So at least they can be honest with their spouse about it and their feelings and it doesn't create a divorce or that type of thing.

Rachel Muir:

What are your feelings being a ... you describe yourself as an older gay man. What are you feelings about the term queer?

Kelly Harrison:

I don't like it. Yeah. Because I was brought up that that was a bad word. So in the '80s yeah, that ... so yeah, in my head it's a ... I mean, and it's odd. The word queer means odd. So yeah, just to me, it just resonates with a taunting 00:16:00word that you grow up with. And it describes as being odd. Even though some people described themselves as that way, and I'm a bit conservative in my kind of thinking and the way I do. I'm liberal socially but I'm also kind of conservative too. And to me that opens it up to a whole bunch of interpretations that people can take the wrong way. Yeah.

Rachel Muir:

One of the questions that emerged from this workshop we did a couple of weeks ago, it was asking the question about self care and the LGBT community. And I know that's an area where you have some expertise, but what is self care mean to you? With the challenges that come with being part of the LGBTQ community. How have you responded to the need for self care and how do you see other people in the community responding, or not, to self care?

Kelly Harrison:

Yeah. Well I believe in taking care of you and you doing what's best for you. Again, I'm kind of an introvert, so for me to be around a whole bunch of people all the time, regardless of gay, lesbian, straight, whatever, that's exhausting for me. So for me, taking care of myself is with my work is to make sure that I don't wear myself out. That yes, I'm going to be friends with people, but I'm not around people that are exhausting. If they're exhausting, then I'm not going to be around them because that's just not my personality. Self care. I mean I exercise, I try to eat right. My partner and I, we're not ... we're not very sociable people, even though I talk a lot and I may seem very sociable and we really don't have people over at our house.

Kelly Harrison:

I'm not big on going out and doing things. So occasionally here and there I 00:18:00will, but I'm more of ... my way of taking care of myself is doing my exercising, making sure I get seven, eight hours of sleep, to not overstress myself or overstimulate myself with a lot of people or chatting or talking or that type of thing. And just kind of knowing who I am and what's best for me, and not based on what people think I should do. At 47 I'm not 20 or 25 so, there's that age where you think you should do this and you should do this and you should be around these people. But I'm at the point now where I'm like, I'm going to be around people that I fit with and that type of thing.

Rachel Muir:

Any thoughts about how the community as a whole takes care of itself? Is that getting better or you see trends or?

Kelly Harrison:

Well, I mean my background is psychology. I got a master's in social work. So 00:19:00sometimes I can kind of pick out things if people are doing something they shouldn't be doing as opposed to the other. I think it kind of varies. When I was in Atlanta last month, and I don't go to bars very often, I'm not a big drinker. So I was in a group that I'm not usually in because I don't ... like I say, I go to bars maybe every 5 or 10 years. And so while I was there, I just, I don't know, I kind of noticed there was a lot of drinking. There was talking about each other, gossiping, and that type of thing. So I think sometimes that milieu can be negative in that regard. But then there's also the positive certainly of interacting with each other, supporting each other, and those types of things. So I think the issue, the problem sometimes is that when you grow up 00:20:00in an environment where you lie in order to survive, that can unfortunately carry over into your adulthood.

Kelly Harrison:

And so fortunately, we're now in a society where, be honest, be open with who you are. If people don't like it, they don't like it. Fortunately, most people don't have a problem with it. So it's be honest. But being 47 growing up in the '80s and '90s, you lied about it and that's not a good thing to have. I think to, you couldn't express who you were. So if you had a a boy that you liked in high school, you had to keep it in or you had to self talk and those types of things. And so I think there can be some self-destructive things connected to that, whether it be anxiety or depression or just a low self esteem. So I think it's hard to get out of that, how you grew up. And not be able to be perfectly 00:21:00fine when you get older.

Kelly Harrison:

Fortunately I have good parents, and I've got a good head on my shoulders, and I've got good friends and that type of thing. But self care, I think I try to do my part working at the Y and helping folks be positive and encouraging and be smart about making choices and that we all make mistakes and we're not perfect. But to try to live a good life and make good choices.

Rachel Muir:

Kelly, I know you've got an appointment coming up, so probably good to stop there, but thank you for your time.

Kelly Harrison:

You're welcome.

Rachel Muir:

Thank you for your insights. And thank you for your contributions to the oral history project.

Kelly Harrison:

Yeah, you're welcome.